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Barcelona U10 7-0 Real Madrid U10

just a preparation for the future

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BVZ9OcsCEAAxOBw.jpg
+6
Real Madrid U10 will probably blame the referee
+6
UEFALONA U10
They tried to field Ronaldo and Pepe, but they threw tantrums so often they were considered too childish.
+9
Easy guys. Those dark siders can't take a joke.
Yeah Jeroen, they'll flag the s ht out of your post and Tanmay will delete it.
I loled at jereon's post.

Besides EVERYONE knows we are only supposed to flag Franky's posts.
+2
It's all good. I have the privilege of being around for a long time and most Madridistas who aren't new will understand it's just one of my jokes.

edit: Danny proves the point :)
The Senior team should watch clips of that match and use the strategies for the Clasico next month.
It's priceless when you see cules celebrating winning a trophy in front of a huge madrid flag and a bunch of sulking madrid fans.
The fact that there is a rumor swirling around about Barca potentially getting Marco Reus honestly seems to good to be true. I know it was told we would sign him, then loan him back for a year back to Dortmund. Still would be nice to hear "Marco Reus has officially signed deal as FCBarcelona player"
That'd b e my dream come true!
+1
Whoa. Reus, Iniesta, Messi, Suarez, Neymar....
I want one more solid defender pleaaaaasee...
I'm not sure we need anymore defenders or players for that matter. We have alba, Adriano, Mathieu, vermaelen, pique, bartra, alves, Montoya. We have bought douglas to loan back to sao paolo which might be in jeopardy at the moment.

In midfield we have busquets, mascherano and song (should be gone soon) xavi, rakitic, sergi Roberto, iniesta, rafinha, Pedro, neymar, suarez and Messi. Plus, we have La masia attacking options.

Overall, these are the most options any barca coach has had for several years now. Last year we traveled with 17 players including oier at times. The depth in this team makes me wonder if this is a madrid team because we have never had so many options as far as my memory goes.
Tello is on for a few seconds and creates the 0-1 for Porto! :D
+2
Barcelona putting a sensational bid for reuz from borussia.it is believed we are rushing him on him due to transfer ban,and if we get him this season,we will loan him to bvb straight away for season long loan.

Don't know what to say,he is fantastic and am a huge admirer,cuadrado move dropped out by our club already.but what will happened to our young breed of wingers then??

I need your thoughts about this as well.
I think it's just a stupid rumor. But if we really signed Reus he would probably be our new right back lol
+1
I think if we sign Reus we are actually gonna play him as more of an AM, or a player similar to Iniesta, capable of playing in the midfield or the wing
This is so ridiculous, I can't believe the ban upheld and that we have to buy for 2 seasons right now.

I have my fingers crossed that we found a winning formula and that our predictions for next season are on point.
One more defender!
"Reus and Cuadrado are, besides Koke, other players Barcelona could try to sign now and loan back to current clubs for one season. [md sport]"

Buy ALL the players! Reus, good lad.
+2
You beat me to it:)
We missed out on Bendtner. I hate zubi so much for that!
+2
lmao F4F, it almost brings tears to all of our eyes :D
damn, is this even barca?

I'm feeling like I'm dreaming.
This comment has been removed.
we need some funding for cuadrado and hummels paid back in two seasons time, you can collect dani alves as interest
LOL sell some loan to Glazers they need more loan
+5
Official: FIFA reject appeal of Barcelona against transfer ban, Barcelona won't be able to sign players in the next two transfer windows

note: barcelona's transfer ban will start after the ongoing window, can't sign in January and summer 2015, can sign again in January 2016

Zubi got 10 more days to plan for a year

Edit

Official: Barcelona announce they will appeal against FIFA's transfer ban at the Court of Arbitration for Sports #fcblive #CASLONA
They were always going to CAS with their appeal. Why would FIFA reject their own decision? They might have a hearing in 2-3 months but this matter will be resolved before the next transfer window.
So the ban is now for a year and a half? January 2015 & Summer and January of 2016 as well as forcing us to let go of the players we supposedly signed wrongly?!

Talk about Draconic measures. This looks like a witch hunt more than a suitable punishment (which should be given to every one of the thousands of clubs who violated the same rules).
+1
No. Its going to be winter and summer transfer windows. Since nobody really makes big transfers in winter, we will end up buying new players only after 1.5 years. Good time to get our youngsters playing.
it MAY happen at other clubs but i highly doubt it happens anywhere near the extent at barca, i mean common there there kids flying in from korea, cameroon brazil etc who are not even teenagers yet. i dont think any club is doing such activity besides barca. wasn't there a big fuss because one of those kids wasn't allowed to play at all for some reason? i think the korean kid.
+4
I realize it's against the rules, but these families and kids who move to Barcelona are as good as always MUCH better off then they were before. Ask Messi.

And we're far from the only club doing this.
+4
I said it when Barca got the ban in the first place, it's stupid. Do you really think Asian/Middle eastern academies are good enough to produce the top footballing stars? They have a much better shot of making it big in Europe, especially if they train from a young age. Same goes for the American kids (North and South), it'd probably be better for them to get the European exposure early, since the best will inevitably head here anyway.
+6
SIF: actually a lot of clubs do this. It is estimated that there are around 25-30000 kids in Spain alone from other countries. Plus they are investigating madrid and Valencia for the same thing. What barca did wrong was when they received a warning from FIFA they took the whole thing lightly. They didn't play the kids anymore but thought the altruism in giving kids a better future would be a good argument against FIFA red tape. Messi is the prime example of the system. He was brought in at she 11. As per current FIFA rules he should have stayed in Rosario and led the rest of his life without medication for his growth hormone issue. I reckon, barca is going to put him up as the prime example as to why no harm was done to any of the kids. I don't think they will be able to reduce the punishment but the portrayal of Barcelona as some child trafficking club is astonishing.
+1
Lgw: absolutely. If barca, arsenal, chelsea or any of these clubs came to my door telling me they think my kid has potential to be a professional football player, I will be more than willing to let him have a shot at it. Why not? If he fails, he can always play for madrid.
+1
@Jeroen & F4F,
I don't think anyone will argue that signing Messi was bad for him or his family. The rules are in place, however, so that parents are not tempted to sign their children's lives away to complete strangers in the hopes of making a fortune. Sadly, there are parents out there who are willing to do such things.

Our club may have the most noble of intentions when signing youngsters but the risk of exploitation and child abuse/neglect is extremely high in these types of situations. Our club should have been more respectful of the rules and played by them, simple as that. We took a huge risk and now we get to pay the price. I'm truly disappointed that we received a clear warning and continued to blatantly violate the rules believing that we were somehow above them.
+1
^Again, exploitation? I've heard of regular companies exploiting children, but what sort of exploitation could arise from playing football? It simply makes no sense. Besides, if the rule is stupid, clubs have the option of simply ignoring it, which is what Barca did. It just so happens that Barca is the club they chose go make an example of, and other clubs for whatever reason chose not to back Barca.
+1
^You think kids at youth academies only play football? Many of the youth leave their families behind to live 24/7 at the academy. Presumably, the children will go to school a certain amount of time each day and then train afterwards. But if parents are not around to monitor, who protects the kids from being bullied, abused, or forced into child labor when they are supposed to be in school?
Alfrodo,

Who protect them? The same laws that protect anyone else. Parents have never been the sole protection of children in western countries, and often enough, the state has to protect children from their parents. If the fear is exploitation, then legislate against that, don't ban the possible future of children just on the off-chance that they're being exploited. Monitoring the wellbeing of children by a state organ that has nothing to do with the parents or the club isn't magic, it's something that is done already. This is like banning cars because of drunk driving.
Alfrodo: I understand the concern around child trafficking and abusing kids for their football potential. The regulations that FIFA currently has are generic to make any valuable change. When you suggest that a child cannot move to Europe from outside Europe unless the parents move to the city for non footballing reasons, you pretty much stop every kid from outside Europe from having a footballing career in a big club in Europe. So unless your family is rich and can afford to just make a new residence in Barcelona, a kid cannot come to play for barca. Even within Europe the child's home is required to be within 100 mi of the club which pretty much restricts clubs from the big leagues to recruit only from within their country. Clubs can also not provide sustenance to the child's family in lieu of the kids footballing talent. So basically what FIFA is telling everybody is they know what is better for the future of their child than the parents of the child. Whenever you make regulations which are all encompassing like FIFA's regulation on recruiting kids, it is bound to fail.
JRaty,
You speak like someone who has never had children or seen children at the mercy of the state. You assume that children (or even teenagers) know who to call for help if they are being abused or exploited. Think about the fact that many of these kids are in a foreign country speaking a foreign language. You think the state will just magically know when kids at academies are being abused? Even if the kids do know who to call for help, they run the risk of losing a spot at the academy! Quite the recipe for exploitation right there, regardless of whether it has happened or not.

All of those scenarios are assuming the child even makes it to an academy to begin with! FC Barcelona may adequately care for the kids, but there are countless others who don't give a damn about the children:
http://www.thesefootballtimes.net/#!prisoners-of-their-own-dreams/ctif

F4F,
I never said I agree with every detail of FIFA's regulations pertaining to this subject. In fact, I think the rule about the child only being able to join if parents are moving to the area for non-footballing reasons is excessive. My point was that the general regulation is to protect the children from shady academies and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Children's safety and well being should always come before football. I would rather have the rules be too strict than too lenient. Our club has every right to disagree with the rules and appropriately get them changed. But just because we disagree with the rules, doesn't mean we can break them and expect to not be punished.
+1
Alfrodo,

And you assume that there's no way to protect abuse other than having the parents there, you assume that having the parents there would in any way affect the ruling, and you assume that having the parents there would stop abuse. Abuse is like any other law, and has to be stopped by society, and not by a individual.

Barcelona doesn't just adequately care for kids, they provide exemplary care. If the problem is that some don't, then that's where the legislation should be targeted. You're argument that all good academies should be banned because there are bad ones is completely asinine.
I never said there is absolutely no way to protect children except having their parents there. What I am saying, and surely you can't disagree, is that having their parents there to monitor and supervise greatly reduces the chances of exploitation. Contrast that with parents who are in Africa or Korea and have literally no way of knowing what is going on in Europe other than what their kid tells them.

"You're argument that all good academies should be banned because there are bad ones is completely asinine."

I never said anything even remotely close to that; you are reaching desperately and provided the asininity yourself. I never said good academies should be punished because bad ones exist, I am simply in agreement that academies should be held to certain standards to protect the kids. I think it's more than fair to say that not all institutions operate at the same ethical standard. Without regulations, institutions have the leeway to take advantage of kids who are oftentimes completely at the mercy of the academy without the knowledge or resources to defend or protect themselves.

By your logic, because Barcelona provides exemplary care for the kids, no other academy in the world should have to obey the FIFA laws. That is like saying just because my grandma drives the speed limit and is exemplary, we can get rid of speed limits worldwide. That is classic asininity right there.

"If the problem is that some don't, then that's where the legislation should be targeted."

Exactly! So instead of breaking the rules, we should have legislated a change. We chose to disregard them, and now we pay the price. If we can somehow prove that there were no instances of neglect or abuse, wonderful. That doesn't change the fact we blatantly violated FIFA's regulations.
Alfrodo,

Then you're ignorant. The case isn't because Barcelona is being held to some standard, it's because Barcelona isn't allowed to train kids that aren't spanish under any circumstances. Maybe you should actually know what the FIFA laws are that Barcelona are being punished for breaking before going off on rants. So the proper use of your analogy is that your grandma is banned from driving a car because there's a possibility that someone somewhere is driving too fast. Or to put it in another way, no-one is allowed to drive, because someone might drive too fast if driving was allowed.
JRaty,

I'm ignorant? You are the one claiming Barcelona can't train any non-Spanish kids under ANY circumstances. Let me inform you that is simply not true: They can train any kid who lives in the European Union between 16 and 18 or any kid of any age who moves to Barcelona with his parents for non-footballing reasons. That is strictly at la masia. Now if you broaden your horizons for a moment... Barcelona can train ANY aged kid of ANY nation if they have an academy in that country and the kid lives within 100km.
http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/affederation/administration/01/95/83/85/regulationsstatusandtransfer_e.pdf

And why are you acting all butthurt about the regulations as if FIFA is at fault for wanting to protect kids? The rules are not new, in fact they are over a decade old now. Barca, and many other academies, have had plenty of time to adapt or legislate and we willfully violated the regulations instead. Are FIFA making an example out of Barca? Probably. We tout our academy as if it is heaven on earth while blatantly violating the regulations. Not surprising we were targeted.

And if you don't think what I posted earlier was relevant, read this statement by FIFA explaining the ban:

"The Disciplinary Committee underlined that FIFA takes the protection of minors in football very seriously. The protection of minors is one of the key principles included in the agreement concluded between FIFA, UEFA and the European Commission in 2001. The Disciplinary Committee acknowledged that young football players are vulnerable to exploitation and abuse in a foreign country without the proper controls. This particular fact makes the protection of minors in football by the sport’s governing bodies, especially by FIFA, even more important."
http://www.fifa.com/aboutfifa/organisation/news/newsid=2313003/

Protection from exploitation, like I was saying...
And you support this legislature and think it's beneficial to kids? You think that FIFA did well with this legislature that means that no kid in countries without word class footballing infrastructure has a bats chance in hell of ever getting world class footballing education? Then you're delusional. It's a universal ban on all international youth development, and you'd have to be a complete imbecile to think that the provisions that a kid is allowed to train at La Masia if his parents miraculously happen to move to Spain for *non* footballing reasons would change that. And you'd have to be a even bigger imbecile to think that it's even remotely feasible or possible for a club to open world class academies the like of La Masia around the globe so that less fortunate kids get a chance to actually pursue their talents.

That statement you posted is saying absolutely nothing specific. It's pure buzzword spin without offering a single shred of proof that what Barcelona is doing isn't in the best interest of the minors. FIFAs words mean nothing if their legislature doesn't match it, and they don't. Their blanket ban is in no way beneficial to anyone, it's robbing all talents in non footballing nations of the possibility to grow because FIFA is too lazy or stupid to actually legislate for the problem.

Yes, Barcelona broke the rules, because the rules are ridiculous. That's what many do when they feel that the rules are wrong. Rosa Parks didn't move to the back of the bus even though the rules said they had to. Barcelona didn't stop offering a chance to a better life just because FIFA made a blanket ban.

But I'm sure that if FIFA says that it's the best for the children, then it must be true!
I never said I support every aspect of the regulations, I said I understand the spirit of why they were created. I also said that we should have operated as a club according to the regulations and changed them properly instead of blatantly disregarding them. And the notion that it is not possible to create academies in other countries in plainly false. Here's some proof of your ignorance:
http://fcbescola.fcbarcelona.com/florida/

You are more concerned with putting words in my mouth, getting defensive, and calling names. I don't know why I even bother trying with you when you act like a child and make dramatically false statements: "it's robbing all talents of the possibility to grow"

Because nobody can grow outside la masia or Europe! All football will surely die! Get a grip and go ask Neymar, Suarez, or Sanchez whether they required international training before the age of 18 to become world class footballers.
There aren't any aspects. The whole regulation is point 19. That's the one rule that Barcelona broke. You either agree with it, or you don't. There's no other aspects to it, no matter how much of the FIFA Cool-Aid you drink. Barcelona isn't FIFA, Barcelona doesn't make FIFA legislature. Just like Rosa Parks couldn't change the legislature either. But she could protest against it by not complying.

What you're proving is your lack of basic reading comprehension.

I said that clubs can't open world class facilities like La Masia around the globe, and you use the Florida academy as an example? I hope your kidding me, trying to compare that with La Masia.

I said robbing all talents in non footballing nations. Last I checked, Brazil qualifies as a footballing nation. Uruguay and Chile as well.

You're not even bothering to read now, so what would not trying entail?
There are several aspects to the regulations, if you actually read them... instead you defend Barca as some hero for blatantly breaking the rules rather than going about it the correct way.

So in your twisted mind it is impossible to create a world class academy outside of the original one? Noted. Way to count your chickens before they hatch. Sure, it's not feasible to build dozens academies across the globe, but since when did our fountain of promising youth run dry? There is no reason for us to be scouting across the globe with the plethora of talent in our backyard, especially if it means violating the regulations. It's nothing more than unjustifiable greed.

What is with your obsession with Rosa Parks and failed analogies? You are acting like somehow kids are oppressed because 'big bad FIFA' won't let them leave their family to travel across the world and live with a bunch of strangers where the chance of them being exploited increases 100 fold and their chances of failure far exceed their chances of success. There are many things more important in life than kids learning football to entertain you. You have pretty low morals if even FIFA is above your standards. You fail to have empathy for children because you can't think past gratifying your own pleasures. The regulations are in place to protect kids from people specifically like you. Thanks for making yourself an example and proving my point.
Alfrodo,

Keep drinking that FIFA Cool-Aid man, it seems to do wonders for you. For the children!
+1
@Alfrodo
I see your point, but isn't it a little arbitrary? I mean, for a kid to make the trip all the way to Barcelona (I'll use Barca as an example), he must at least be a little interested in the sport. And for the majority, they want nothing more than to play football. In some countries, due to the coaching techniques, the lack of facilities, the lesser obsession with football kills a considerable amount of talents. Kids who could have been great footballers have killed their passion to pursue other careers. These kids loved football, but the lack of opportunities killed that passion.

Now on to exploitation, it's a little different but think about it this way. Regulate the football academies, meaning, they have to provide a high standard of care like boarding schools do. It's probably already there for the big clubs. I mean, some people have no issue sending their kids to boarding schools, so I see no difference in football academies.

Of course I take your point that not every kid succeeds in the system, but what's worse, trying and failing, or not having the opportunity at all? As someone who failed to even make the cut at the Arsenal academy (I was lucky to have been born in London), I can safely say I don't regret trying. But what about those born in places where they have absolutely no opportunity? And by that I mean places where there isn't a good football club within the permissible radius.

All in all, whether a kid decides to join the academy of any club should be a decision taken by the parents of the child, the club and most importantly, the child himself. If all parties are agreeable, then there is no reason why FIFA should step in imo.
Basically, FIFA doesn't want to do the paperwork related to protection of children so they place an outright ban.
@Jraty,
Keep resorting to personal insults when you have nothing better to say. Stay classy!

@LastGraspWinner,
I like where you are going with the idea of regulating academies so that they are held to the same standard as boarding schools, but don't you think those regulations should be in place BEFORE the academy recruits foreigners, not after the fact?

Even still, going to a boarding school within your own country where you are already accustomed to culture, language, etc. is completely different than moving from Africa or Asia to Spain. Have you ever moved from your native country to a completely foreign country with no family support for an extended period of time? I did when I was 19; it was extremely difficult and took months to adjust (and I even knew the basics of the new language)

I appreciate you sharing your personal experience with the Arsenal academy. But like you said, failure wasn't a big deal because you lived nearby. It probably did not cost your entire family's fortune to fly you out and you probably had family with you or near you the whole time.

Contrast that with an 8 year old Asian kid with a dream, leaving to France only to find that he sorely misses his family, has nobody to communicate with, and hates the food. Then subject him to the possibility of neglect, abuse, or exploitation. Did you consider the enormous power differential between a 6-17 year old kid and an academy full of adults or other kids who could abuse him? You think a kid is going to tattle on abuse if the academy tells him they won't release his visa/passport if he snitches or they threaten to cut him from the academy? Couple that with the fact that academies must do everything in their power to maintain a good image and you have a great recipe for exploitation, especially for foreigners.

@F4F,
FIFA are looking out for minors and took precautions to protect them, quite the opposite of laziness as you imply. They are attempting to protect thousands, maybe even hundreds of thousands of minors across the globe from being displaced from their families with extremely low odds of success (and huge financial and emotional costs) and very high odds of abuse or neglect. I don't see how that is a bad thing. There are plenty of players who make it to the big leagues after age 18 without having to be transplanted across the globe to do so: Drogba, Klose, Javi Varas, Ramires, Dzeko, Maurice Edu, etc. etc.
Actually no, they aren't. What I was trying to say was they have put in place restrictions for non European players which makes it next to impossible for kids to come to big clubs. A better idea would be to monitor clubs closely for all their recruits. The problem with that is FIFA will have to spend some of its billions on monitoring clubs which is a lot of paperwork. Plus FIFA will have to take responsibility while allowing people to move around freely. Every kid deserves a shot at glory. That's how the western world works. It's one thing to protect kids and another to come up legislation that is too wide in its scope. Laws work well only when they are precise and serve the purpose they are designed for.
"FIFA takes the protection of minors in football very seriously. The protection of minors is one of the key principles included in the agreement concluded between FIFA, UEFA and the European Commission in 2001."

So you think FIFA is lying and that they put the regulations in place for their own financial gain so that they don't have to "monitor" transfers? That doesn't really make a lot of sense considering Messi (a young international transfer) has increased popularity and revenue for football worldwide, which only benefits FIFA. If money were all FIFA cared about, they would be urging clubs to buy internationally all the time to increase the chances of finding the next Messi and improve global marketing. FIFA is far from a perfect organization but to imply they are plotting to destroy all kids' dreams of playing European football for financial gain seems way off base.

And I don't really know what you mean when imply that FIFA just needs to spend money to "monitor" clubs and file some paperwork. Are you saying that you think it is FIFA's responsibility to monitor the well being of every underage international transfer across the entire planet for the entire duration of the transfer until the child is 18?
Benatia agrees terms with bayern.
If this happens

http://apocalypstick.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/patrick-bateman-axe-gif.gif
+1
Good luck Mehdi, I was hoping Lucho is going to go after him, but it is ok. I'm happy with what we have right now, as long as Bartra gets a good look and Mash plays CDM.
https://vine.co/v/M39qVmwm1Zz

OMFG 24 months ban
Biting someone on shoulder is much dangerous then trying to break someone's nose , its a physical sport , man up !!!!!!!
The best part is Ramos' acting after the punch where he pretends that its Mandzukic who is trying to cheat. Pepe's like, "What's the big deal? In my house, this is called Christmas morning!"
MT: A slap is okay in your world I suppose?
+3
Show the whole thing, then decide which part was more injurious:
http://youtu.be/GuhRDn4HIbU

I'd personally also classify it more as a slap than a punch, but I can understand it viewed as a punch.
This is more of a punch:
http://youtu.be/Sah-_BAwS64

If you enjoy acting, you'll enjoy this:
http://youtu.be/vHahaV3rME0
Notice the aggregate score.
+2
Mt,

What exactly are you saying?
Mt,

You can't be serious.

Humour:

'Some theoreticians of the comic consider exaggeration to be a universal comic device'.[19] It may take different forms in different genres, but all rely on the fact that 'the easiest way to make things laughable is to exaggerate to the point of absurdity their salient traits'.[20]

If you seriously thought that OMFG 24 months ban was anything but a joke, I feel for you. On another note, of course it's heat of the moment. Pretty much anything that happens on the pitch is heat of the moment. Unless you're talking about Brandao's head-butt in the tunnel against Motta it's safe to assume that it's heat of the moment.
+5
@JRaty Mainly that Ramos' reaction was heat of the moment. Still idiotic nonetheless (putting a potential expulsion decision in the official's hands).
Mandzukic is a wind-up merchant, a la Ramos and Pepe.

@Franky4fingers I'm neither condeming nor condoning in my comments, just trying to be accurate and call a spade what it is. Give context and perspective.
Is hyperbole okay in your world?

And if you don't accept the "heat of the moment" argument then EVERY single footytube user would get the "OMFG 24 months ban" due to comments made in an "emotional" moment.
(See what I did there?...)
+7
Hyperbole? Is nonsense okay in your world? What I think should be done is they need to stamp out (pun intended) all forms of intentional violence from the sport. This nonsense that within "context" of the situation these things happen so we should consider is grade A b s. We go around accepting and forgiving these little instances and you have Ramos who throws around elbows like its nothing. The fact that you are not condemning it is the problem with football fans. You call it "idiotic" when it comes to Ramos' reaction but condemn Mandzukic as a wind-up merchant.

Mandzukic did exaggerate but do you want me to post videos where Ramos is intentionally throwing elbows in his opponents' face and getting away with it? Give me a break.

And I don't think you did anything there. It didn't make any sense. Reacting in a split second on the field and typing up a post from the comfort of your home are two completely different situations.
+3
@Franky4fingers Irony/hypocrisy/nonsense/hyperbole/etc.
Call it what you want.
You call Ramos' elbow "intentional violence" but nowhere mention Suarez' bites. Nor do you mention Mathieu v Getafe:
http://youtu.be/chvpbt8zA6I

Sure, let's get rid of intentional violence. But you also understand that not all violent actions deserve the exact punishment, correct?
A Ramos elbow is worse than a Ramos punch. Therefore a 10 match ban for either violent act wouldn't be fair.
Similarly, a Ramos knee to the head is worse than a Ramos elbow. Agreed?

Plus, as I mentioned, how do you discriminate between "intentional violence" and "idiotic reaction due to the heat of the moment"? If there's a difference, how would you punish the two?

Also, how effective of a deterrent would such punishments be? The person would be 100% habilitated after a suspension, and they'd never commit the same act again?

Like I said, "Mandzukic is a wind-up merchant, a la Ramos and Pepe". Which means there an ABUNDANT amount of videos of all 3 simulating and elbowing and kicking and expressing incredulity.

To summarize, let's use your own words:
"The best part is Ramos' acting after the punch where he pretends that its Mandzukic who is trying to cheat"
later followed with:
"Mandzukic did exaggerate"
+5
Mt,

So according to you whenever someone talks about someone doing something bad, that person has to mention all previous incidents of similar nature? Talk about hypocrisy, because you yourself don't do that. You're full of s**t.

"Two wrongs make a right" is a fallacy of relevance, in which an allegation of wrongdoing is countered with a similar allegation. Its antithesis, "two wrongs don't make a right", is a proverb used to rebuke or renounce wrongful conduct as a response to another's transgression.

The unstated premise is that breaking the law (or the wrong) is justified, as long as the other party also does so. It is often used as a red herring, or an attempt to change or distract from the issue. For example:

Speaker A: President Williams lied in his testimony to Congress. He should not do that.
Speaker B: But you are ignoring the fact that President Roberts lied in his Congressional testimony!

Maybe we should submit you as a example to be used for the wikipedia article?
+6
Suarez' bites? LOL See, strawman again. READ my posts CLOSELY. When he bit, I said he should be banned. A few posts below you wrote a sorry apology for Ramos but you completely ignored that I wrote this in the same post:

"I didn't think Suarez' ban should have been lifted. He is a repeat offender and even though his biting is more reactionary and harmless like a petulant child than someone throwing punches, it definitely is inappropriate behavior for a grown up."

I'm not suggesting any particular punishment for anything yet. I just said that Ramos usually gets away with it because this is Spain. Remember, intention is important in any crime. You could accidentally clash with someone and break his bone and its okay for me. But if you decide to intentionally slap, bite, poke in eye, punch, spit, headbutt…nothing is acceptable to me.

By the laws of the game, simulation is a yellow card. Violence is a straight red. I prefer that refs stick with both these rules strictly.
+7
"The best part is Ramos' acting after the punch where he pretends that its Mandzukic who is trying to cheat"
later followed with:
"Mandzukic did exaggerate"
----
I personally think Madzukic exaggerated but you can never know the extent of anybody's injuries. When Zuniga hit Neymar in the back and Neymar went down screaming in agony, most people in the bar where I was watching said, "Get up you w****r!" Turns out he fractured his vertebra. What are the odds of that happening? This is why refs give the benefit of doubt to the person who is injured or pretending to be injured.

Whereas, Ramos knew very well he slapped/punched Mandzukic intentionally. So the oscar goes to….drum roll….RAMOS!!
+6
@JRaty "So according to you whenever someone talks about someone doing something bad, that person has to mention all previous incidents of similar nature?"
No, I didn't mention anything about "all previous incidents".
My point was that I like what you've done with your glass house, it complements your stone collection very well.

I don't exactly follow the part where you started paraphrasing wikipedia. I didn't say Ramos actions were justified. Further, I agreed with banning intentional violence. I was asking how do you punish the various acts?
More importantly, how do you determine whether they were intentional or not? Surely there are grey areas.

@Franky4fingers Yes, I apologize about the Suarez' bites part (you said that below, tho I disagree and think his ban was excessive but agree it shouldn't be lifted completely).
My point remains: Song's actions were worse, and Mathieu's could have a desperate argument also made that he had a Medel moment. Point is, you'd only be up in arms if it were a Madrid player. Hence, I'm questioning your sincerity and genuineness on the issue.
It's like listening to Mourinho's latest lunacy about how he's finally developed a squad able to beat those damn clubs that park the bus and are anti-football.

"I just said that Ramos usually gets away with it because this is Spain"
Ummm, not sure how to respond. Mourinho-esque.

You raise a GOOD point:
"You could accidentally clash with someone and break his bone and its okay for me. But if you decide to intentionally slap, bite, poke in eye, punch, spit, headbutt…nothing is acceptable to me"
What if Ramos elbowed you, and then you elbowed Ramos back. Is that different?

"By the laws of the game, simulation is a yellow card. Violence is a straight red. I prefer that refs stick with both these rules strictly."
I agree, but life isn't that black and white.
Just the other day Costa got a yellow against Burnley for simulation, even though the keeper made enough contact that it would have taken down much weaker players such as El Haddadi. Thoughts?

More black and white and gray:
"I personally think Madzukic exaggerated"
You agree there is NO WAY anyone can be legitimately punished with the argument of "I personally think"?
Thus, you should consider that officials also cannot follow the rules strictly when it's hard to know, even in retrospect.
+2
Mt,

This is just more of your fallacious logic that the previous actions of Barcelona players have anything do at all with what Ramos did. The only possible, even though weak, argument why that could ever be the case is that the people condemning Ramos have defended similar actions in the past, but you've shown nothing of the sort. And even then, all you'd prove is that the people condemning Ramos are hypocrites, not that they're in any way wrong in condemning Ramos. I know that I condemned Suarez, and I know that I condemned Song. All you've done is post links to Barcelona players doing something similar in the past and by some stupid leap of logic assume that that somehow invalidates those who are condemning Ramos for what he did against Atleti.

I post wikipedia because you don't seem to understand that what you're saying makes no sense.

If you're familiar with FIFA rules, you know that offenses made after the whistle is blown are punished much harsher than offenses made during play, because there's no way they can be construed as a late or reckless challenge. After the whistle is blown, it's clearly unwarranted violence. Mandzukic challenge was during play. It was reckless, but it was a challenge. What Ramos did was after the whistle and can in no way be a challenge. What he did can only be seen as unwarranted violence after the whistle has blown.
+7
If you're making an argument about referees opinions and their mistakes, then I'm with you. But what I dislike about Spain is the lack of discipline amongst the authorities when it comes to such actions. In Spain, unless the referee includes an incident in the match report, RFEF will not review the incident even if there is video showing violence. In England, they don't just rely on the match report. This is why BPL's brand is much more successful than La Liga in terms of marketing. There is no conspiracy theory about it. Punishment in Spain is a lot more lenient than England. Diving is more acceptable in Spain than England.

You will not be find me supporting Song or Mathieu. Unless players receive lengthy punishments for violent behavior its not going to change. The same goes for diving and play acting. Barcelona ended up getting a bad name for their on field antics during the mourinho days. Nobody really remembers mourinho's tactics though. One of the interesting things about Mou's time in Madrid was after the 5-0 demolition, he trained his team to seek and destroy. The next outing where the game drew 1-1 was physical annihilation of Barca. Pep and his players were shocked at what was happening. The next game they started flopping around as soon as they got touched because refs don't caution everything that is worth cautioning for fear of ruining a contest. But in the process they ruin the game for the teams.

I actually admired Mourinho until the eye poke. To me that was the lowest anybody could get as a coach. And the shameful thing is he didn't get punished because the ref didn't include it in the match report. That's Spain for you.
The fact is that bites, slaps/slight punches, etc. are basically the same thing. It might hurt for a few seconds and then it's over. They are punishable offences in football because of the violent intent, not for being actually dangerous to the opponent.

Suarez got deservedly a long ban because he's a repeat offender. So is Ramos, for example, but he always gets away with these thing. And he does things that actually are dangerous.
I can't believe anyone would not agree that punching someone in the face doesn't deserve a ban.

Ramos should face some form of punishment for his horrific actions.
+2
Boys! Calm down!
You lot could maybe have some quality conversations if both sides could leave out the feigned sense of incredulity at everything the other is positing.
+2
*googles incredulity*
El Haddadi in a nutshell:
http://youtu.be/3elItreM-r8?t=1m18s
Its probably a cliche to say he's the next Messi but he does have several traits similar to Messi. He doesn't let the ball go easily, he has a great first touch, he has an eye for passes and of course, his finishing is top class. I would have preferred to let him go on loan this season to a good club where he would get first team action regularly. Unless, Lucho plans to bring him in for games against smaller teams.
Franky with deulofeu gone , i'm sure Haddadi & Traoré will get lot more minutes , i'm not sure about sending our players on loan , especially when the clubs don't use them as starters , though i'm happy that sevila is willing to use Suarez as starter and hopeful that deulofeu remains injury free and get lot more min with sevila then his tenure at everton .

I was off the idea that Halilović will be the first B player to get promotion but Haddadi , Traoré & Samper will give him tough competition .
Halilovic is settling in. Samper plays in a different position than him anyway. At the moment we have Suarez, Messi, Neymar, Pedro with Rafa and Iniesta having the ability to push up. I thought Deulofeu should have stayed and was surprised when Barca shipped him off. I suppose Sevilla guaranteed him a starting spot which he wouldn't get at Barca. I don't see Munir getting starts this year. He might get a few subs here and there but overall, I think we're saturated up top.

Samper is the next Busi so once Xavi and Song exit, there is place for him. Halilovic might (if he develops) finally take up Iniesta's spot but that is a good 2 years away. Munir will tear up defenses at Barca B this year so let's see what Lucho does with him. I think Barcelona has to make some tough decisions in the next couple of years about a lot of players : Traore, Halilovic, Suarez, Munir, Samper, Deulofeu; because we surely can't give a place to all of them.
Deulofeu went on loan because he wasn't able to impress Enrique and he told him in no uncertain terms that he won't be getting a lot of minutes this season. Deulofeu has been repeating that he needs to improve defensively, so I can only assume that that's the reason Enrique gave as to why Deu wouldn't have been playing.
+1
I'm excited to see how Suarez develops this year.

Our new batch of young talent ( to take over from current players) includes:

Munir (CF - Messi), Halilovic (RAM/CAM - Iniesta), Dennis Suarez (LW/CAM - Iniesta), Sergi Samper (CM - Busquets), Traore (LW/CF- Pedro),
Then we have the young established first team players:
Sergi Roberto (CM- Xavi), Deulofeu (RW - Alexis), Rafinha (CAM - Iniesta).

Then we have Bagnack, Le, Patric, Grimaldo who could potentially develop into first team defenders not to mention Bartra and Montoya.

What do you guys think? Dreamteam #3?
Samper is something else. Reads the game like Busquets, holds the ball like Xavi and dribbles like Iniesta. And Traore, well, he's a crazy physical specimen.
Curious, what exactly about El Haddadi says that he's "not ready"? His age?
Can someone give me concrete examples? Because if he's not ready, then I'd say 95% of the squad should get the same treatment he gets.
Physicality, for starters. If he plays against your favorites, Levante, he will get manhandled. Let's not talk about him facing your favorite thugs from Madrid, Pepe and Ramos. He is good enough to start but we have way too much talent ahead of him.

I think he should be subbed in for games where we are in a winning position. He could start for games against smaller sides.
+1
Mt,

First, the amount of games played. He's got a whopping 11 games to his name in the Segunda. Second, his consistency. He played two good games this preseason, but did little in the others. And it's telling that he only produced in the two 6-0 routs. Third, he's got no experience against though sides, having only played against Segunda teams and the like. Fourth, he's got a tendency to freeze when there's not a clear option for him to take. Happened even in his game against Leon when he got possession and there was no way forward.
@Franky4fingers Actually, him being physically capable is why I'd start him. Messi is the only other player I've seen to have stronger balance with the ball at his feet.
Can you give me examples of him not being able to handle physical play?
It's hard to conclude he'd be manhandled by Pepe/Ramos/Levante when he's yet to be outmuscled by anyone thus far.

@JRaty
Those whopping 11 contain just as much football quality as the whopping 4 preseason matches he's played the past month.
What does "did little" in a match mean? Because he didn't score?
Here's El Haddadi doing little v Nice:
http://youtu.be/NI4LQQt_qQQ
Here's El Haddadi doing little v Napoli:
http://youtu.be/xhm7PNIyXzs

If he has no experience against tough sides, then you can't conclude either way that he's "ready" or "not ready".

"he's got a tendency to freeze when there's not a clear option for him to take"
Post vid link. Preferably the Leon match.
Mt,

Doing little, as in he did little worth mentioning. Which is why his highlights are only a whopping 4 minutes over two games, and even those 4 minutes are mostly nothing to write home about.

11 + 4 is still only 15, and he was a starter in only 4 of them. He's got less than 500 minutes for Barca B.

A player is not ready until proven to be. The fact that the he has no experience against good opponents means that he's unproven. You've got no basis on which to say that he's ready for the A team because he has never faced A team opposition, so the position that he is ready is both completely unfounded and a huge gamble. You do not prove a statement by not testing it and then saying that there's nothing refuting it, you prove a statement by testing it and showing that the results support it. My record against La Liga teams is as good as Munirs.

Show me a Leon clip that has all his touches, and I show you where he froze. Expecting me to rewatch 90 minutes and edit that down to un-highlights in response to you posting highlights is a bit lopsided as far as effort goes.
To me it's quite simple: no matter how talented you are, you should be introduced slowly. Otherwise you'll get cocky, or worn out, or fail to progress if you can't keep performing well every game.

It was the same for Messi, Xavi and Iniesta, the three best players of Barça in decades.
+1
Mt sure loves Munir.

But I'm sure he wouldn't praise him so much and talk about Munir-Messi-Suarez attack if it didn't mean benching Neymar.
+5
Maaza,

If Munir turns out to be good enough to bench Neymar, I'll be ecstatic. How great would that be? But if ifs and buts were candy and nuts we'd all have a merry christmas. Hoping for something won't make it true.
I think Munir has potential to be like Messi. But we also have Bojan as an example. He had a stellar record but ended up not reaching his potential. He is still 23 and could revive his career but that won't happen with us. Bojan's big problem was he was shoved into the first team in a hurry and then received call ups for the Spanish national team. He couldn't handle the pressure and just stopped performing.

Its very important that raw talent gets eased into top competition. Sometimes players are naturally conditioned mentally to handle the rigors of being a sportstar. Then there are times where they can't handle the limelight and either collapse or become complacent. Plus, physical conditioning is of utmost importance. As athlete if you pick up a serious injury initially, you're screwed for life. That's why I think Munir should be slowly released into the first team. If he shines as soon as he's given an opportunity, then let him have it. But he has to prove that he deserves a spot ahead of players like Dennis Suarez, Deulofeu, Rafinha and even Neymar.
@Maaza,
Precisely. Yet if Suarez were the one to be benched instead of Neymar, Mt would instantly become a major critic of Munir instead of a fanboy.


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20
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UEFA Champions League Table

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8
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9
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10
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0
0
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11
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12
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0
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13
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14
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22

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