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Sticky Toffees
17 hours ago

Latest Manchester United Match Round Up

Last Match
Premiership Sun, 4th Dec 2016
Next Match
Europa League Thu, 8th Dec 2016

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Page 1 of 10959
Still can't believe Fellaini had to go and do that. Threw our lead when there was no need. Of all the luck.
stand behind your manager... as soon as we start winning, "I always believed in him."
Stand behind him and criticise when he makes poor decisions like he did against Everton.
+2
I just hope he learns, thats all. As long as that is the case, 1st season is a test season.
I disagree, wasn't a poor decision. it just didn't have the expected outcome. Crosses were coming in from both sides of the pitch, baines and delufeo or w/e, and everton brought on another aerial threat in ener valencia, there's absolutely nothing wrong with bringing in fellaini to help defend that. you're just biased against fellaini and pissed off, that doesnt make your argument sound.
+2
Yeah, he did a similar thing against Leicester in the community shield to see out the game and I didn't see any complaints then.

Fellani let the team and manager down with his recklessness, like a few other players in previous games with their individual mistakes.
I think it is a poor decision. Fellaini is not and will never be a defensive player - he has always been most effective at the other end of the pitch. The season he had with Everton before his United move he was playing just behind the striker for them. That was him at his best. You put him in midfield and you see a guy who can head the ball well but you also see someone who is clumsy and lacks a high footballing IQ.

Also, @SoccerIsFootbal you just mentioned that Everton "brought on another aerial threat in ener valencia" - do you realize that he stands at 5"7. And forget everything else when you have Bailly on the bench surely he can do a job for you if you desperately need an extra man to deal with crosses; or even bloody Bastian Schwienstiger.

Sorry to say but you are just biased towards Mourinho, because you and many other United fans spent the summer talking up your team and your acquisitions of Zlatan and Pogba and co. and your new world class manager. You have to defend him because now you don't have any excuses left.
+3
Sif I'm not just talking about the Fellaini substitution, that whole second half was pathetic how we dropped off and allowed Everton to pile pressure on us. How many times is a manager going to try and defend a 1 goal lead only to concede late.

I remember posting during the game that the second half would make us drop points and that's before the Fellaini substitution. The last 20 minutes werof pathetic how can we defend that?

Yes I'm biased and pissed about Fellaini so I won't pretend to like him but the blame that night was Mourinho not Fellaini, its inexcusable how he gets away with so many poor decisions when if Moyes and van Gaal did the same fans would be slating them.
+2
Bastian to deal with Areal challenges? Lol sure. He would get burned for speed and Mourinho will be slated for bringing a player on with no legs. It's a lose lose situation for Mourinho. People will keep talking till he starts winning.
Gotta look at both sides of the coin, and in that regards, Doc, you're being too harsh. I do agree though that Fellaini is not a defender, so we can't simply say "he let Mou down." If I had asked before the game, is Fellaini a clumsy player, the answer would have been yes, absolutely. So you get what you get, to an extent, when you put him in defense.

My main problem, as Cjay pointed out, is that we keep inviting pressure on ourselves late in the game. Up until the 70th minute, Everton were hardly a threat as far as I remember. We let them back into the game by sitting deep and allowing them to control the ball in wide areas, and same with Arsenal who didn't have a shot on target till their goal. Why, then, are we letting this happen? This isn't the fault of the Fellaini sub in particular, but it is something Mourinho needs to work out, perhaps by going and getting 2 goals before sitting back. We've only been able to do that a few times this season.
+1
Cjays it's easy for you to say we just sat back and defended after we scored, but thats not accurate. We did go forward and try to score the second, the way you are describing the game we just camped down in our box after we scored which is absolutely false, we went forward and had chances to score, most notably herrera strike off the post and a couple of saves. Our attacking play kept breaking down around the box, thats poor play not the coach asking the players to keep losing the ball and making bad decisions. And as a coach, at some point you have to decide between going for another and saving your lead. I think he waited until 85th minute to bring Fellaini on. Naturally, everton are already losing and can afford to throw more attackers on and go for it, and thats what happened. We were ineffective going forward and everton committed more numbers into their own half by the end of the game, also with positive subs (enner valencia, deleoufuo or w/e) to try and get a result, which they did.

footballdoc, does enner have to be a tall player to have an aerial threat? 2 of is 8 career premier league goals are headers, I have watched him play at west ham, he's an aerial threat, he has a huge spring. similar to how chicharito was one of the tiniest players on the pitch but he scored his fair share of headers, and we all remember wayne's turn of form a few years ago when he was scoring with his head, you dont need to be lukaku's height to have an aerial precense, and we all know the crosses were being fired in by everton.

bastien isnt as good defensively as he is going forward, and furthermore, he's not as good in the air as fellaini.

bailly has just returned to the bench from a knee ligament injury, he has not played in several weeks. There's every possibility he's not as ready to play as fellaini, who hasnt had an injury and has been training with the rest of them.

You dare come here and talk about bias, you're one of the more biased fans on this entire damn website. How dare you say i've been talking up mourinho all summer? I am one of the utd supporters who did NOT think mourinho was a good fit for this club, go ask the chelsea supporters. For my money, I kept repeating the one reeding quality of hiring mourinho was we know he buys top players, and we needed top quality. I am aware of his flaws and the baggage and all the nonsense that comes with his tenure, but as long as he's united manager I will give him his fair chance and "unbiased" fans like you, who come in making unbalanced arguments and throwing accusations need to be checked.
https://youtu.be/gERdfiU2CBQ


One of the best moments after SAF era. Even though we lost that game it was amazing. The celebration with the players and staff. Valencia beating Bayern defenders like nothing lol

so as much as i hate mou, the fellaini sub makes sense in context. at the time, lukaku was standing on rojo and dominating him in the air, obviously fellaini was meant to help with that.

the troubling bit of this is that it was a fairly typical performance otherwise during the match. created very little and came unstuck at a bit of pressure.

the sin for me was not playing mata - i think he's been our best player so far this season and when you need to keep the ball and break down a stubborn defence he's your man. not sure why he wasn't even on the bench. he doesn't seem to get injured at all.
+3
Because Martial and Mikhi had to start. no more room for Mata
week in and week out it will be the same s**t. we were pushing for Mkhi to start and he did and lets be honest he was pretty poor. Now we wish Mata had started, Carrick, Martial etc...

Pfff this whole team sucks.
+4
When was Fellaini ever good defensively in the air for United? Most are fooled by his height when most of the time he's losing his aerial duels unless he elbows his opponent.

That's the problem with United these days, we lost good aerial defenders in Vidic and Rio and we thought signing Fellaini will help us defend set pieces. In reality it hasn't, I cant recall him being even good offensively in the air for us like he was at everton.
+2
sure convert Mata to Striker, or bench Pogba or Herrera, sometimes you need to do sacrifices in order to win.

But to be fair we have no big issues in attack or midfield. We have leak in defense. Conceding 1 goal like that every game is unheard of.
whats absolutely baffling is the fact that while tree failed to do his job on a number of occassions, there`s a player who vanished during the last weeks from the squad although he already showed that he is able to do that job even better and even in a number of different positions.
i miss tofu in the squad and cant find a single reason why he is not asked to play more.
+2
we need our messiah
kayteo is spot on! the substitution made perfect sense. in the last min everton were putting crosses in the box and fellaini was an ideal chice to deal them

cjaystack what are you saying?! fellaini has won 74% Ariel duels this season for man united in epl this season. so you cant say he is bad in air.

dom1878 mikhi was not getting any sort of help from valencia who was playing very deep esp in the first half (check out his heat map) and had no one to put in a cross because ibra was playing very deep in respect to his original position so he had no choice but to drift inside to help ibra. the system mourinho used yesterday was not ideal for attacking player like mikhi.
+2
^Honestly people just make stats up depending on their mood or argument lol.
+1
Choosing Fellaini to play in the midfield (or anywhere for that matter) because he is good in the air is like choosing Bravo to play GK because he is good with his feet. You are basically excelling in a minor part of your job while not being that good at the main job. My old boss used to say 'Don't major in minor things'.
+4
he took off mkhi for fellaini, i cant see how that was a bad move considering everton were getting in crosses. fellaini let the boss down, it was clumsy and unnecessary, but im not sure how you fault the logic. it's a common-sense move imo. mkhi wasnt in the game and we needed help defending the crosses. if smalling or bailly were available and ready im sure they would have been subbed in
Not really. It is a valid tactic to counter the presence of Lukaku. Its easy to say after the fact that Fellaini should not have been brought on but there have been some games before where LVG brought on Fellaini to see off the game. I have Wenger bring on Gibbs to play LW on many occasions to see of a game. When it works, people say tacticsl masterclass and when it goes wrong it's called a failure by manager. I will never criticize a manager for trying different things to get or secure a result. It's what they are payed to do. It comes of many times and on some occasions it dosent.
Yaldho mourinho has already brought on smalling into a game late on to defend set pieces and crosses, it's nothing new. fellaini messed up but i don't think you can fault the manager's logic. he even tried an attacking sub with rashford on for martial but that didnt change the game so then he made a sub to protect the lead.
Why were they getting in crosses? Because we sat back and invited their pressure, and could no longer hold the ball. Fellaini surely wasn't going to help that. I get that it's a valid tactic, and it's not all on the manager. But something has to change when this same tactic (as performed by the players) has let us down many weeks in a row. There's got to be another way to add defensive stability than by throwing a tall CAM in front of the back line.
+3
Joey. When is the last time we used this tactic and it back fired?
^ How about 2 weeks back when Rashford was brought on late, found him at LB and owned by Ox for Arsenal's goal? Its the same principle throwing in a player who does not fit at LB.
What is the purpose of bringing in a defensive sub at 87th minute to see off the match with a 1-0 lead? The best team out there must be playing in defence and midfield to secure a draw, not the time to introduce a calamitous subsitute in a position that does not suit him.
The plan is to see out the game you already have gone 87 mins without conceeding, so the defence has so far been ok. By what logic does throwing in some amateur elbowing goon who cannot pick a decent pass as CB/DM make any sense?
Fellaini should not play again.

Bailey was available (on the bench), so was Blind why were they not selected ahead of Fellaini? Man Utd were dealing with crosses OK till upto that point Fellaini came on and this guy cant play with his feet at all.

For all those stats for him Fellaini he cant defend against crosses or headers either see the video of him getting shamed in an aerial duel in his only other contribution apart from giving away that penalty:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lY6J7uvbzJg&t=0m28s
+3
Arsenal, as Vaaz said, brought off Mata for Schneiderlin too I believe. Stopping the crosses by not letting the crosses in in the first place sounds better to me. Taking off a winger for a CM does nothing to cut the supply of crosses, it welcomes it. But look, I recognize that you can't have it perfect every way all the time, and I acknowledge that Fellaini let everyone down.
+1
Actually vaaz you make a terrible and great point all at once.

Bringing on rashford to play leftback, are you insane? Is that what you think happened? Rashford was playing LM, we already had a leftback on the pitch in blind, who was nowhere to be found and summarily dropped the next two matches. You cannot blame that goal on rashford, who played the ENTIRE match (was not a sub like you claimed) and was moved to Lm after starting as cf. If rashford wasn't there people would ask why rashford didn't track back. The real question was where was blind?

And perhaps mou bringing on fellaini was due to rojo and Jones getting f****d in the air by Giroud for that goal, did you ever stop to consider that? Neither Jones or Rojo are dominant in the air, I see nothing wrong in bringing more cover if you think that's the main threat. Not sure what blind could have done to help the situation and Bailly hasn't played in 1-2 months, to throw him into a game like that was risk in of itself.
+1
for all his height and "power", fellaini is not the best header of the ball. he wins some aerial duels but its not the dominance you would expect from someone as tall as him.

blind or tofu (although not on the bench) would have been the better choice. the one a powerhouse the other is extremely smart in his positioning and often manages to win duels when you`d think he has no chance.
Optajose stop posting fake stats and quote your source please?
+1
Cjaystacks fake stats? lol sorry mate you are making a fool out of yourself.

okay if you dont believe me here is the quote you asked for

https://www.premierleague.com/players/3604/Marouane-Fellaini/stats?se=54

aerial battles won 35

aerial battles lost 12

that is 74% success rate:P

I'd rather play Fosu-Mensah or Sean Goss than that tree. If we are going suffer like this, I'd rather play youth and suffer like last season, because its making no difference when the seniors keep making mistakes a youth would make.

Still raging.
+3
Some of Mou's choices have been highly questionable. How can you even decide to put a decorated player like Basti in the reserves yet keep giving chance after chance to a shitcan buffoon like Fellaini?
This is probably the last benefit of doubt Mou should get if Fellaini is ever seen with the first team again I'll just assume mourinho has lost it and is no better than moyes on current form (despite stats saying that already)

I think the club is handicapped by successive managers who don't have the balls required for this job. Fellaini should have been shipped out long ago he just isn't a man Utd player no matter what he can do or can't

And there are huge problems in the defence too if Bolasie and Lukaku can turn Darmian inside out repeatedly and burn him for pace then real world class players like Messi/Robben etc will write Darmian's obituary. Just not good enough at this level
+4
Damn the amount of negativity in here is making me sick. Do you really want to make Mou the scapegoat for Fellainis error? If Fellaini won a last minute header against Lukaku everybody would say that the sub was spot on. Yes our position doesn't match our ambitions, yes we still lack some balance but at least I don't f*****g fall asleep during our games anymore! But have fun thinking that Mou has lost it after just one bad season, he will make you eat your own words.
+2
He will make you eat your own words? To be honest, he's not the Jose we're used to. The man turned into a s**t manager.

Look at the amount of Money he has spent mate, look at the position we're in and think about the statue on this club. Dropped 8 points in the last 5 games! not the red devils I'm used to. We need to employ someone right for this club. Bring back the fast counter attack, the crossing play, the switch of play, the last minute winners, the comebacks. Not happening for us at the moment.
+5
^^If it were not happening so often i would agree with you man. But it's now 6 draws. 6 games thrown away so easily. We can blame the refs, the opposition whatever but its own fault and mainly Jose. What was the use of bringing Fellaini in ? Why was he defending on Gana ?

Jose has really lost it. Football is not about scoring one goal and sitting at the back now. Even if you have a 2,3 goal lead that means nothing. We had a good example with the liverpool game yesterday.

How many times have we set back after scoring the first goal. I don't know if you have seen Etoo itw on Telefoot yesterday. He was talking about Jose. He said he is different. He is not the same person who was in charge of Inter and he added a football team cannot defend 90 mins.

I happy i'm not falling asleep too but man when the final whistle blows, i think it was better to have fallen asleep instead of seeing this stupid result again and again.
+3
Right, I won't be surprised if you called him a genius if/when we go on a winning streak. Its pretty easy to see how some of the players are f*****g it up so badly at crucial moments with glaring individual mistakes, not sure how the manager can control that.
+1
we will turn ourselfs in Arsenal fans if we actually get winning streak and somehow get in top 4 while blaming Jose all the time.
Thank god there few fans here who understand that the situation is not as bad as it was under lvg and moysi era. It is easy to blame a manager. Sometimes points in the table does not give the right picture of how good or bad team is playing. The margin of wins and draws has been very fine in last 2 months. those 1 points could easily be 3 points on many occasion. even yesterday we had almost sealed the victory but fellaini made a silly mistake that mourinho has no control over. So its stupid to blame him solely. yes we didn't play an attractive football to large part of the match but it was because we were at goodison where every big team struggle. he had his tactics spot on until that penalty.
TBF we havent got 4th for three season now lol and dont cut down TREE guys other wise you will contribute to global warming
+1
What's more infuriating is that s**t still having a big smile on his face at the final whistle, despite of the fact how he let his team down. No remorse!! f*****g clown. Absolute garbage.
+5
Burn that tree, sack the s**t one.

Never been so upset since the chosen one rolled over to City
+4
I blame fking Moyes for buying him at the first place.
+1
f*****g tree did it again, was out of the team for a while, got brought in just to do that. f*****g shit.
+2
Fellaini is an atrocity committed upon this club. He's had so much negative energy and connotation attached to him since day one. He'll always bring us down no matter what.
Oh and Mourinho...smh
+5
And he cost the same money as Alexis Sanchez...
Don't forget he was a panic buy
Tree is s**t, we all know that, but what was Mou smoking bringing that s**t on. All Mou's fault.
+1
I 100% agree with what Garry is saying in the video above. That's exactly what I mean. This maybe a team full of bottlers.
+1
Neville was spot on. Fellaini may be terrible but for that specific situation he was the perfect player to shake up Everyone attack, clog up their midfield dribbling to force them to pass out wide and also physical enough to help defend the likes of Lukaku AND Fellaini would be unencumbered by the atmosphere as he used to play for Everton and knows how some of their players play and their tendencies. PERFECT substitution just Fellaini is not mentally tough enough as seen by his mistake. Saw a Zlatan interview on United TV a week ago and him saying 40% of top flight football is actual skill and physique but the rest is all mental. This team is not mentally tough enough to handle the red devils Jersey.
+1
The teams above United this season: When they are on top of in the game and dominating teams they make sure they score a lot of goals during that period.

However United: Dominate teams,score 1 goal, miss a couple of chances, and sit back in the last 20 mins to concede a late equaliser.


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31
19
14
33
1
4
9
14
2
30
17
18
35
2
3
9
14
3
30
15
15
30
2
3
9
14
4
27
14
10
24
1
6
7
14
5
21
3
16
19
3
6
5
14
6
20
3
17
20
4
5
5
14
7
20
1
16
17
4
5
5
14
8
19
-3
19
16
5
4
5
14
9
18
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22
19
6
3
5
14
10
18
-6
24
18
6
3
5
14
11
17
-2
15
13
5
5
4
14
12
15
-2
15
13
5
6
3
14
13
14
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26
24
8
2
4
14
14
14
-11
23
12
8
2
4
14
15
13
-7
24
17
7
4
3
14
16
12
-14
29
15
8
3
3
14
17
11
-10
24
14
9
2
3
14
18
11
-18
29
11
9
2
3
14
19
9
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31
16
9
3
2
14
20
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0
0
0
0
0
0
3
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
4
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
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5
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0
0
0
0
0
0
0
6
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
7
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
8
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
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9
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0
0
0
0
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10
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
11
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
12
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
13
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
0
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3
2
1
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5
3
2
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