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Spain's Uncharacteristic Play...the Fault Of Del Bosque, Ego, Or Something Else
Kushdog21 (AC Milan) 4 years ago
You may be startled by this as Spain are still in the tournament, which obviously takes an enormous amount of skill/luck, but I've been watching them all tournament and have yet to see them play to their potential and can't help but wonder why. Off the top of my head I can only think of a couple reasons for this:

1) Del Bosque's tactics squandering their creative talent by, among other things, breaking the connection between Barcelona's star midfield duo, and thus greatly hampering the attack. I'm not a coach but IMHO it would seem logical with the type of talent the national team has, they could closely mimic Barcelona's tactics and much more efficiently utilize the immense attacking nature of many of the squad's starters.
2) The clash of egos in the lineup could be hampering their play
3) A mixture of things, something else (Torres' slow injury recovery, historical bad WC performance, etc.)

The only reason I wonder is because I feel like they easily have the talent and their players have familiarity with the tactics that have proven successful (to Barca in a tougher champions league tourney). And yet I wonder if they will live up to this before losing to Germany or the Netherlands, which I feel they could easily beat playing to their potential. Anyway, I'm just curious on why Spain's struggles seem to continue and how complex it really is
Juno (AC Milan) 4 years ago
Spain's main problem currently is that they lack width in all their WC matches up till now. Iniesta tends to drift into the centre of the park, Villa is a centre striker by nature, add that to Torres, Xavi, Alonso (all stationed in the middle of the park), All the attack has been going through the middle. The only real width provided by Spain is Ramos, but his last ball lacks precision.... Its only when Torres is taken off, and the focal point is back to Villa(funnily, slotted on the left side of this weird formation....) that they scores most of the time.

Torres, meanwhile has been a disappointment in this tournament. Unable to hold the ball up, losing possession, squandering chances. He made Lorente seems more talented.

And oh, playing Xavi so high up is probably a wrong tactic as well. It meant that there's more markings done on him.

Blueskiesahead (Chelsea) 4 years ago
I agree completely.... There is no coincidence that some of spains best play has happened to be while jesus navas is on the pitch
Juno (AC Milan) 4 years ago
Or when Pedro is around. He tends to pull the defenders away from the middle with his runs down the left...
Shuds (Barcelona) 4 years ago
Well there is no other option but to play Xavi that high up, let me explain. Del Bosque has had to do without the services of one Mr. Sena, which is the main problem for Spain cause they really don't have another hardman like him in the country. Which is why he had to solve this problem by putting two Defensive mids, one that can also attack and one to support and just defend. Since this is the case he had to go for a 4-2-3-1 formation which essentially is a 4-2-1-3 where Xavi plays a little higher up.

I think its a good formation and things have been working well, maybe they are not as good as they were in the Euros but that's just the drawback of not having Sena on the squad. If you look at the stats Spain have always got a lot of shots away, IMO the only thing that is a problem right is the Finishing. Villa has been the only one who has been scoring and also initially when Torres and Villa were playing the team lost its width almost completely and now its back to normal with Pedro back on the flanks.

My conclusion is that Spain have been playing well, its just that its very different this time around and it might seem boring but it works. They have dominated almost every single game they have played including the Switzerland game. Lets just hope it gets better tomorrow
Chickenegg (Barcelona) 4 years ago
The only difference is actually the coach. Imagine if it's still under luis aragones. They will work, but I'm not saying vicente del bosque is a poor coach. It's just the way both think and they think differently. Naturally, spain's form of playing will be different.

But on the other hand, I think opposition teams have finally work out how spain works. Just look at ottmar hitzfeld's switzerland
Pragathish (AC Milan) 4 years ago
Del Bosque.... And why the heck is Torres playing on the flanks and trying to dribble past players and utterly fail at it?
He is a natural center forward, and not a winger, I suppose...
ManUK (Manchester United) 4 years ago
Torres just isn't working anywhere at the moment. He looks out of shape and out of form. I'm surprised he's still starts every game. Fabregas seems more effective playing behind Villa
Rob12 (Manchester United) 4 years ago
I think it's because Spain think there too good. They are good but they have some arrogance of there play now that there better than everyone
Sharpoon (Hull City) 4 years ago
I really don't understand their midfield, Xavi, Iniesta, Xabi Alonso and Busquets. They're all great palyers but they just aren't going to work as a fluid midfield. Silva and Navas would give them much more width and allow Villa to stay in the middle, and if that means dropping two of the current midfield then so be it. Torres is also not helping the situation by being unfit and massively out of form
CHELSEA61 (Footytube Moderator) 4 years ago
.... Have you guys been watching the same team I think you're talking about? Spain are in the semis. This is not a problem. The midfield is the most solid part of Spains' game apart form David Villa scoring at will. How can their play be criticized? They have stood up so far and played to win and accomplished their goals. If they lose to Germany then we can start to break their faults down. Besides, Paul the psychic octopus has chosen Spain to advance.

Link: news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/europe/10521867.stm...
Hill (Arsenal) 4 years ago
Are you watching the same Spain team that was supposed to steam roll all opposition and beat everyone into a pulp? Nope. I'm not. They just don't look like they can compete against a really good squad. I would argue that they haven't faced anyone who is any good. Portugal and Paraguay had awesome defenses, but sub-par offenses. And Spain struggled against them. What are they going to do when they come up against Germany who has a pretty good offense and defence?
ManUK (Manchester United) 4 years ago
I dunno I'm very doubtful of spain, they don't look as good as they should be. I want Spain to beat germany but I would bet on Germany making it to Soccer city
Juno (AC Milan) 4 years ago
Agreed with Hill, Spain are suppose to whip everyone to submission, Yet they struggle almost against everyone...
Hill (Arsenal) 4 years ago
And now sadly, the most boring team in the tournament (Spain) are going to win the World Cup. I can't see Holland beating them if Germany can't
Kushdog21 (AC Milan) 4 years ago
I think Holland's got more grit and maybe a more skilled attack than Germany did. While they have played similar styles this World Cup, everyone forgets that Germany is an extremely young team (third youngest in the tourney at 25. 0). I think that played a huge part against them in getting cold feet and looking a little scared of what Spain could bring at them with its reputation. While Spain is young the success of Real Madrid and Barcelona, added to the familiarity a lot of these players have with one another helped them not get caught in the enormity of the moment. The Dutch will respect Spain as well, but they have a better D, grittier midfield, potent attack and a much older team with tested vets who aren't nearly as susceptible to losing their nerves. I think the Dutch (even though they are probably slight underdogs) may actually pull it off and Spain may now suffer from a bit of cold feet, on such a big stage with so much history against them
Rob12 (Manchester United) 4 years ago
The thing about Holland is, they some how score goals, and there good goals. I can't call the game between Spain or holland as Spain keep on beating teams 1-0 and Holland just score goals and make it in to the next round
Hill (Arsenal) 4 years ago
I don't think Holland have a better D than Germany. I do think Holland can win. They did beat Brazil, and I put them in the same category as Spain: ridiculously talented, but winning in a boring manner and not by much. So I suppose I agree with Rob again. Holland score goals in someway and make it to the next round! GO Dutch!
Rob12 (Manchester United) 4 years ago
Hill before the world cup we never agreed, but we agreed like ten times in the past week lol
Hill (Arsenal) 4 years ago
Haha! I was thinking that too. Hilarious. We'll probably go back to the trenches though when the EPL comes around. Although I expect our disagreements will be a lot more ah.... Courteous perhaps? Haha
Tony (footytube staff) 4 years ago
Well after watching tonights game were spain won 1-0 I hope holland win the world cup.
The spanish have been boring, and they bored me and the germans to death with their over eloborate passing, is it any wonder they don't score many.
Any other team breaks, its 3-4 passes and goal, not with spain, its more like 20 passes, then nothing at the end of it, and the oppositions defence are all back in position, so they don't break very well.
They could speed their game up a bit, the way they are playing at the minute is boring, no way would I pay for a ticket to watch that
Northstream (Tottenham Hotspur) 4 years ago
If Germany didn't have ten men defending it would have been more interesting. Problem is that the other teams have far too much respect for Spain and let them dictate the game. I think Spain play efficient football and they're trying to open up the opposition. Had Germany not had all men back defending we would have seen earlier break-throughs and more goals
CHELSEA61 (Footytube Moderator) 4 years ago
Have you guys forgotten the Dutch just beat Brazil who tried to play the same game that spain play. I don't think that the final will be as boring. One can only hope
Northstream (Tottenham Hotspur) 4 years ago
With no South Americans nor England in the final, I'm certainly happy to see Spain vs Netherlands. Great thing that it will be a new country winning, only the 8th of all-time
Tony (footytube staff) 4 years ago
That's the only thing refreshing about this world cup, we'll have a first time winner
ManUK (Manchester United) 4 years ago
The other matches have actually been good for a world cup. Spain made their entire part of the bracket boring though
StefanJay (Arsenal) 4 years ago
I agree with ya chelsea61. The Dutch will come with the same tactics as they had for Brazil. They will press the midfield, take a foul when they have to and break up Spain's flow. The style of refereeing will have an impact
ManUK (Manchester United) 4 years ago
Yes I hope he calls it tighter, it will make the game more about skill than rather physical strength
Tony (footytube staff) 4 years ago
I want the dutch to score an early goal, I think if that happens, we could be in for a hell of a match, should spain score first, I can see them becoming negative and stifling the game
ManUK (Manchester United) 4 years ago
The best thing for Holland to do is attack. If they are cautious spain will pass the ball forever then score mid way through the second half. Then it'll end that way.

Spain aren't very good in the open field attack, so I wouldn't worry at the back as much, if Netherlands get a goal in the first half then spain have to score and that makes for a better more open game. And a better chance for the famous oranges
CHELSEA61 (Footytube Moderator) 4 years ago
Teams that play a strictly offensive style get shut down easily. I think this style is Del Bosque's doing and its designed to keep the ball in the opponents end even if you're not scoring. Its worked so far. I don't think its that bad, especially because they're winning, and not on penalties. The funny thing is there's nobody in here who supports spain. Because they're all out celebrating the WIN
Kushdog21 (AC Milan) 4 years ago
I just want to make clear, it's not that I don't support Spain or that was the reason I made this thread. It's well-known they have an enormous amount of talent, maybe the best assortment of any team as they did have the best betting odds coming into the tourney and were favorites. And of course they have at least played somewhat well as they are in the WC final, beating some giants. But given their play the past two years, it's odd to see them not dominating games like they had been in that stretch (and dominating means more than just dominating possession because that's related more to the team's stylistic choice). It's almost as if they have developed the expectations Tiger Woods had in the golf world (before getting caught), and how even though they are winning they aren't playing up to their true potential. Seriously thus far in the tournament their defence has had to play spectacular and David Villa's had to carry the team on his shoulders a couple times to save their ass. Xavi hasn't been completely up to par (though today he played brilliantly) and Iniesta has had a mediocre tournament at best
Hkremixboy (Fiorentina) 4 years ago
To Chelsea:    Spain has lots of chances after scoring a goal, Pedro, Villa and Torres miss lots of chances to shot the ball
Ant (Liverpool) 4 years ago
Spain could have had three or four today if Alonsos shots had been on target.

Spain had 13 shots, Germany had 5. Any team that can do that to a side that's been banging in four goals a game against World cup teams, deserves to win.

I find Spain very entertaining. The passes are crisp and stylish, the runs are clever, the attacking is inventive and the defending is solid. Perfect football
Northstream (Tottenham Hotspur) 4 years ago
Completely agree with you, Ant!
Had Germany managed to score after Pedro didn't play Torres alone in front of the goal, I think Pedro would have been hanged, drawn and quartered...
Rob12 (Manchester United) 4 years ago
Spain passed something like 565times lol, and the average passing for a team is in the 300s
Pragathish (AC Milan) 4 years ago
Yeah, gotta' agree with ya Rob.... Too much passing around.... Sometimes it gets boring, and sometimes it gets annoying
Hill (Arsenal) 4 years ago
I love their style when I'm playing in a match. But when I watch I find it insanely boring. I can't stand it. I want both teams to have some possession. Not one team to have 99. 9%!

And out of Spain's 13 shots at I'd say about 6 of those were from outside the 18. Out of those 6 maybe 2 were any good from outside. Those are shots the defence will gladly give up
Pragathish (AC Milan) 4 years ago
Yep, and I'd also love it when the team I support play with this style. But a huge no no when my opponent, or a team which I am neutral towards do it
Hill (Arsenal) 4 years ago
Agreed! Maybe we should become Spanish fans...
ManUK (Manchester United) 4 years ago
It's death by a thousand passes with spain lol
ManUK (Manchester United) 4 years ago
Double post
HangTime (Chelsea) 4 years ago
Spain/barca's style of soccer in my opinion is the best. You keep possession, keep the ball away from your opponent, and it frustrates the opponent that they can't get the ball.
Thinking about it, I would HATE to play against a team with this style. It's very boring to play against.... Lol



   
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