Forums / The Stands: Intelligent Footy Debate
Order: Newest / Oldest
Unsporting Fernando Torres
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
I'm sure most of you have seen the manchester united v liverpool game over the weekend, where I seen something I have never seen before when fenando torres vandalised the manutd penalty spot.
I myself think he was very unsporting in his actions, and should have been reprimanded in some way, or still should be, by video evidence.
What do you guys think? , and have you ever seen anything similar in the past regarding pitch abuse.
I know its a bit of a weird one, but torres knew exactly what he was doing, and rooney DID miss the original penalty, luckily he scored from the rebound, but I bet if he had'nt scored, we would be hearing a lot more about it, and fergie would have been on the warpath
Riggs (Manchester United) 6 years ago
I liked torres' little one handed diving demonstration. Like an italian guy talking with his hands but upside down. A grape picker if you will.

In other news a liverpool boy has surprisingly asked a judge to overturn a court ruling on his custody. The court had ruled he live with his aunt, because his parents beat him so much. The boy explained that his aunt and uncle beat him as well. The judge found the only option was to put him under the wings of Liverpool Football Club, because they don't beat anyone.

(not my joke, changed it from chelsea.)
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
Not exactly the reply I was looking for rigg's, but witty all the same.... Lol
Ant (Liverpool) 6 years ago
United fans bashing a Liverpool player? Certainly stands-worthy stuff.

I could round up numerous videos of Rooney diving, punching the corner flag, red card after red card, pouting and whining. We've seen them all before. Torres was frustrated at the confusing award of the non-penalty and Valencia's dive, that's all.

If it was inside the box and was a penalty, Mascherano should have been sent off. If it was outside, it should have been a yellow and a free kick. The ref kind of did a half-and-half.

Again, no point arguing around and around over this. Man United fans will say it was a blatant penalty, Valencia is a knight of the game, a true sportsman. Most other football fans will be confused how he can run another ten yards after being tugged gently, then flop down as if a sniper had taken him out. Always a good indicator if the player is appealing to the ref and raising their arms before they hit the ground. He tried to dive about three more times too but the ref was having none of it.

Its Old Trafford, no-ones shocked that United got every decision. Fergie probably had a little whisper going down the tunnel before the match.


All this topic is going to do is get every United loudmouth out from under rocks to slander a world class player. The same people that had nothing to say the previous three times United met Liverpool
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
Your never off utds back ant.... Lol.
Come off it ant, it was petulent and obvious what he was doing.
Its like a snooker playing walking over and putting a rip in the table before his opponent takes his next shot, disgraceful I thought to be honest.
Rounding up all utds misdemeanors means nothing ant, answer the question the thread is about, you always side track away from the subject to have a go at utd.
I could round up a load of crap about gerrard alone just recently, but its nothing to do with the question I have posed here.
So stick to the thread, I even had a go at riggs in the post above, as his reply had nothing to with with the question either.
You could have a great career in politics mate.... Lol.... Answer THE question.... LOL
Ant (Liverpool) 6 years ago
What's the point? I'm going to say he kicked out in frustration, just at the ground instead of a player, and you'll say he purposefully and evilly tried to create a divot.

In truth he scraped off a small bit of the grass, he hardly created a ditch there. It wouldn't make any difference in the least to a world class player taking a penalty.

Anyway the point of my post was to give the reasons behind Torres frustrations, causing the incident
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
Ant, rooney did miss the penalty, luckily enough he did score from the rebound, or that incident would have been the major talking point over the weekend gauranteed
Ant (Liverpool) 6 years ago
The ball didn't bobble. Rooney took a fine penalty, right into the bottom corner of the goal - but Reina saved it. Its not like it ricochet off a clump and flew over the bar.

Anyway, you think its disgraceful for a Liverpool player to act like that, being a United fan yourself. Unsportsmanlike, even.

I thought it was disgraceful for Neville to leap high-footed and come through Maxi, then stamp on his head on the way down, which had to be bandaged to stop the bleeding.
I thought it was disgraceful for Carrick to lash out and kick Kuyts legs from under him, while Carrick was on the ground.
I thought it was disgraceful for Nani to dive into a tackle two-footed and then flop about like he had broken a leg.

And most disgraceful, none of the above warranted a card, let alone a free kick. Curious how many United fans saw those incidents, or have any comment on them? All perfectly legal and sportsmanlike I presume
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
Start a thread about it ant, I have started a thread about this, without any answers from anyone, except to drag up all sorts of things.
The only reason I asked the question is because it was an unusual incident, and had anyone seen any other incidents of pitch abuse, rooney or tim cahill punching a corner flags hardly gonna' put someone off taking a penalty.
I'm not going into a utd v liverpool row mate, the threads gone badly downhill already.
And there will be more incidents brought to bear, and another thread ruined, like many others on the site
Adamaus (Manchester United) 6 years ago
I'm sorry but what 'punching the corner flag' got anything to do with ruining the pitch, but more improtantly and purposley destroying the ground where you take the penatly. Not out of frustration but from a act of cheating.

there is no point turning this into a diving argument because no one can win because every team does it

"If it was inside the box and was a penalty, Mascherano should have been sent off. If it was outside, it should have been a yellow and a free kick. The ref kind of did a half-and-half. "

That's the ref's fault, not a fault of united.

Next that dailymail article means s**t all, anyone can look over the games and say the teams are favoured more at home, and yes that includes liverpool ant.

Lastly ant your having a go at united and its fans for being hypocritical, well that's kinda the direction you've headed, seriously ant? Are you saying liverpool players don't dive? Or get 'red card after red card', I mean ever heard of macherano. Liverpool does it just as much as united, so does chelsea, and real madrid and inter and AC milan and barca and tottenham and roma etc.... Etc.... Etc.... Same with the whining
Ant (Liverpool) 6 years ago
Ruining the pitch? The man scraped half an inch of paint off and a few blades of grass.

My point is, as explained below, Tony requested examples of unsportsmanlike behaviour. I provided loads
Eric (Manchester United) 6 years ago
Frustrations of Torres aside, could have easily been a yellow. Seen it before for lesser arguments. In no way did it have an effect on Rooney penalty. It was a marginally fantastic save by Reina that could have been much better if he had parried it away from Rooney. The challenge on Park of Torres was rather harsh as well. He's lucky he wasn't sent off in the game. Since it's becoming the argument of preferential treatment at Old Trafford, why wouldn't the official had Liverpool down to 9 men on the pitch? To comment on your other tackles, Neville's challenge deserved a yellow (though his "stamp on the head" was never intentional), Nani is a drama queen which is nothing new, and the Carrick v Kuyt incident was mutual. Bottom line is Torres lost the game for Liverpool (with a little help from Rafa's selection and his affection for Lucas which I'll never understand). Two clear chances my little brother of 8 years could have tapped in and Torres choked on them. A player of his skill should have done better. He just had a bad game, frustrations all around
Blueskiesahead (Chelsea) 6 years ago
I have to agree with ant on the point that torres really didn't do anything to the pitch. Adameus stated that using the point about rooney punching a corner flag is irrelevent because it does not harm the pitch (which is true, it certainly doesn't and the flag doesn't move or break). However is torres kicking the ground really any different from that? These players play on perfectly level, perfectly rolled fields that have absolutely no defects. A typical player in your typical league doesn't get these benefits, yet us amateurs still manage to take perfectly good penaltys. So to call torres a cheater for it is absurdly unreasonable. To call him unsportsmanlike is certainly arguable. But then again its also arguable that rooney acted unsportsmanlike when he punched those corner flags. Its the mental attitude that is seen from the action that is unsportsmanlike not the action itself. Afterall how can an action be considered unsportsmanlike really if you look at the definitions of action and unsportsmanship.

Now to call his act vandalism, I also think is a bit unreasonable. Everyone time a player slides in for a tackle and doesn't position he feet perfectly, will ruin the ground, every time a player plants his foot to take a shot or pass, will ruin the ground, and every time a player sprints, it ruins the pitch. You should see the ground between the posts after a match. Yes these are all necessary acts of the game and torres little act of frustration certainly was not necessary, but the pitch is being torn up either way and to punish him for that you are setting a dangerous precedent in terms of future punishments. Overall, I think we're looking a little too into this whole topic
Ant (Liverpool) 6 years ago
So, just to summarise, all the United fans think it was a penalty, Mascherano should have been sent off, Torres is an unsportsmanlike cheater and vandal and should have been sent off too.
All other football fans think roughly the opposite.

Raj (Chelsea) 6 years ago
I don't think kicking off a patch of grass from the pitch could've stopped any world-class player from putting away a penalty. There are far worse pitches and bad weather conditions that has players running around in a game. Either way, even if Torres had dug a small trench with a spade haha, Rooney could easily just stomp the spot on the pitch and level it up like players do while taking a corner. It's much ado about nothing for me, he was just showing his frustration at the decision and was certainly wrong to do it, no question.... But calling it vandalism is a bit extreme .

Every great player is likely to have an unsporting moment but its a guilty pleasure we all enjoy. We want to see passion and aggression on the pitch, players making a fool out of themselves (as long as they're not on your team) and going loony. It's not a serious incident at all in my opinion, would have had no say in Rooney's penalty taking abilities. If he missed the penalty at the first go, you could either look at it as a direct result of Torres shredding some grass or Rooney not being clinical with that penalty. I just think its more sensible to look at the latter since Rooney could've just as easily levelled the spot before taking a shot
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
Of course players have mad moments, like george best throwing mud at a ref, but we are discussing this subject, and I didn't like what I seen.
I'm not having a go at liverpool, as ant thinks, I seldom do.
Had a utd player done that, I would still have started the thread, because its something I aint seen before, and I'm looking for fans around the world to post incidents maybe they have seen, but as usual it has ended up as a slanging match, I'm sorry I asked the question now to be honest.
I wonder had the boot been on the other foot?
Ant (Liverpool) 6 years ago
By the time I saw this topic it was already a United chuckle-fest, with animations of Torres diving, jokes etc, completely off topic. I just then answered your call for unsporting gestures by listing a few from the same match (Neville, Nani, Valencia, Carrick), as well as pointing out the well-documented and long standing fact that United get all decisions their way in Old Trafford - which is also unsporting.

My point about Rooney was, why pick on Torres and say look how unsporting and what a vandal he is, when in every match in the premiership we see worse stuff - dives, simulations, vicious fouls. In the long run of things, kicking a dozen blades of grass in pure frustration at an unfathomable ref decision is really not that big of a deal
Riggs (Manchester United) 6 years ago
*Serious face on*

A pool-united clash will always bring out the best in all of us.

Heres the video for all to see.

Torres definitely kicked the penalty spot on purpose, in some symbolic spanish witchcraft or to actually try and affect the penalty. Either way, he wasnt doing it to clean it to be nice. He also did his "diving" hand gesture, something I saw incredible irony in. I'm not saying united are angels, (I believe it was a penalty, but valencia did needlessly embelish it. Every team from every country has divers. Its a sacreligious practice that has entrenched itself in the game.) but their actions past and during the game, don't make it acceptable for torres'.

In all seriousness, how big an impact could it make? I mean, players are stomping all over the place, sliding, and falling everywhere. The pitches are worked on full time by many people to keep them ready. Its grass. There were probably a hundred divots like that by the end of the game.

Sorry for derailing this with my initial post, I can never resist
Ant (Liverpool) 6 years ago
I've watched the video about ten times now and I have to agree with you. He hardly stood there stomping and chipping away at the spot. He took a swipe over it in frustration, took off some of the grass, some of the paint. The spot was still 100% visible and completely usable afterwards. You'd think he went at it with a JCB digger with the hysteria on this topic
Sergio 6 years ago
Haha I know its coming wrong but I found it a little funny. But what the hell don't you dare start, ill bring back all those ronaldo dives AND when he went studs up when things didn't go his way.

I'm trying to say, he isn't the biggest baby to play in the premier league
Ant (Liverpool) 6 years ago
To get this topic back on track now that the heat is over, the only incident I can think of where a player changes or damages the field of play, is when the Danish keeper moved the goalposts.

Sergio 6 years ago
Now wow that is strange loooooool moving the goal posts Wow
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
That's the kind of answer I was looking for, something unusual, not kicking players, and diving etc:, that happens in every game.
This incident was unique, I had never seen it done before now.
Lets hope for more answers of this kind,
Nice one ant, I have seen this incident before but had forgotten about it, did the keeper really think no one would notice.... Hilarious in its stupidity alone.... Lol
Eric (Manchester United) 6 years ago
Every centimeter counts guys, haha. Pretty hilarious though; don't think I've ever seen anything like that before  
ManUK (Manchester United) 6 years ago
lool As if there weren't 50 cameras watching him at the moment. Stupidity haha
Pragathish (AC Milan) 6 years ago
No way. Unsporting is too strong for a word. He was obviously frustrated, and I think its a normal thing for every human. And what makes me laugh is that, some Man utd fans saying that Rooney missed the spot kick just because Torres kicked off the marker!He definitely kicked the marker on purpose, that too just to vent his anger, and that has nothing to do with Rooney's penalty miss. Thank god, Rooney scored the rebound, or else you would have tagged him a 'cry baby' or a Ronaldo
Pragathish (AC Milan) 6 years ago
And whats even more worrying for me is, everybody forgot Valencia's dive, and going gaga over Torres's simple frustration, that was obviously because of a penalty awarded for a dive
Pragathish (AC Milan) 6 years ago
If kicking the marker off is 'unsporting', then I'm not sure what would you call Valencia's dive
Sergio 6 years ago
I agree, I'm not sure if it was a dive or not, but the thing is all footballers these days seem to prone to the ground, its a huge influence on the game now, Oh a Fly bit me.... I shall fall on the floor. Honestley its wierd.

But I agree, wasent a penalty and it changed the rythm of the game hence the reason he got pisssed
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
Forget the dives etc; lads, theres nothing unusual in that, sadly that's part and parcel of todays game, which seems to be more and more accepted to the detriment of the game
ManUK (Manchester United) 6 years ago
I don't think you could call it a dive because originally is was a foul and might have been a red card even if he wasn't in the box yet. As for a penalty I dunno but we'll take it
Pragathish (AC Milan) 6 years ago
Come on, it was a dive, but less blatant, at least not like CR7's
Anyway dive is a dive.
There was contact ofcourse;but I'm not sure a gentle touch will make a player fall like if he had been shot down by a gun. He could easily resisted.
Simulation, that is
Rockerr (Liverpool) 6 years ago
Vandalism - ruthless destruction or spoiling of anything beautiful or venerable.
Lol how come kicking the penalty spot or some grass' become vandalism?!Its really funny to hear.
Ofcourse, I agree that kicking the penalty spot was childish but it was just because of the frustration due to an awful dive followed by a poor refereeing.
And what makes me Roll on the floor laughing is, calling it as the reason for Rooney missing the penalty.
Saying kicking the marker will ruin the pitch condition is ridiculous. While playing, players make sliding tackles etc, So can you say that it will ruin the pitch?
Though it was a childish act, it cannot be called unsportsmanship or cannot be the reason for Roo missing the penalty
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
It was a WELL aimed kick, not out of frustration. He meant it.
One question?
Was he right or wrong to do it? No matter how trivial you thought it was
Rockerr (Liverpool) 6 years ago
It was a well aimed kick due to frustration.
Its definitely not right to do so but IT isn"t A BIG mistake. And won't agree calling him unsporting etc
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
I bet had the referee seen it, he would have gotten a yellow card, no doubt about it, and if you had asked the ref why, his answer would have been unsportsmanlike behaviour.
Well you answered the question rockerr, wrong is wrong is wrong, no matter how trivial.
Believe me mate, had it been a utd player, I would have said, whats that prat doing?
I can't believe people think its not a stupid action, what if the ref did see it, and deemed he should have been sent off for it? You would have been on fernandos back for being sooo stupid.
Believe any guys, its nothing to do with him playing for liverpool, it was an unusual incident, which I thought would be a good, and funny topic, like ants keeper moving the posts.
Not a slanging match about liverpool and utd.
Try to stick to the thread guys, I'm looking forward to hearing of other weird stuff that has happened around the world, the world doesent stop at manchester, or liverpool
Rockerr (Liverpool) 6 years ago
Yup, A wrong is a wrong. But it isn't worth criticising or banter about. It is not at all a big issue. It haven't affected the game in anyway.
If it was done by Ronaldo or someone like that, it wouldn't have been a big issue.
If he had done such thing in past like ronaldo or rooney, you can call him unsporting but its not so...
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
It was pre-meditated, he wasnt even involved in the penalty incident, had it been mascherano, I could maybe have understood it
Rockerr (Liverpool) 6 years ago
Well, he is also a human so such small mistakes happens. As you have already said that even George Best has involved in such incidents but you cannot call him unsporting.
Moreover, you have said that diving has now become a part of the game and is acceptable so is Torres' incident which is not even close to the ugliness of diving. If you can tolerate diving, this won't be big thing
ManUK (Manchester United) 6 years ago
Ok, my thoughts. Unsporting is probably a bit strong a word to use for Torres. But it is true he did in intentionality, yes out of frustration but he did mean to kick the spot. I'm not sure whether he intended that to help Rooney miss, but it didn't. No it didn't make any impact on the penalty, because it was a fairly good pen to be honest, outmatched by a brilliant save. But luckily Rooney followed it up and equalized.

As for the Diving issue. Even most Liverpool fans will say that it was an obvious foul outside the box. Whether or not it was a penalty or not is the question. My opinion: Valencia was being completely fouled outside the box, knowing this Valencia knew he could get a penalty if he was fouled inside the box. So he dragged on for a few more feet before collapsing. My mind says Yes he tried to get a pen and he made the most of it but it was a Penalty.

But how would I know? I'm just a biased United fan right?
Rockerr (Liverpool) 6 years ago
"he dragged on for a few more feet before collapsing" - So he could have easily resisted if can drag on for a few steps, , , Right?
Yogan (Chelsea) 6 years ago
Great topic Tony, but in many ways, I have to agree with Ant on this one.

None of us know what was going on in Fernando Torres' head at that moment. He had a swipe at the penalty spot. Now it may have been to take away some of the paint, or it may have been just a sign of annoyance. Either way, it was on the penalty spot and of course, it was deliberate.

But still, are any proffessional footballers blind in one eye or something. It's not like he couldn't see the spot afterwards. It had nothing to do with that he missed the original penalty. Absolutely nothing.

Now the sportsman part of it. Here is where I am on the United fans' side because it was deliberate, unsporting, "vandalism" of the pitch (I actually can't think of any other word to call it). He had the look on his face. So maybe he should have been booked. If the football was there it would have been exactly the same, except he would have kicked an object, not something stuck in the ground. Then of course though, he would have been sent off.

The actual penalty decision was hard for him, but I can't blame him for getting it wrong, Neville ran across him and just nudged Valencia. The Ecuadorian isn't one for constant nagging of the ref like Ballack or Mascha, but he won a penalty and that's good enough for him. He didn't complain of Torres. Neither did any other United players except rooney.

So my summary is there is no need to discuss this in such a foul way if it was 2-1 to Man you. Anyway. And Rooney does that enough.

Sergio 6 years ago
YO GUYS I WAS thinking. You know when torres miskicked the ball and when it fell to Beneyoun, do you guys think he was maybe standing on the un - even bit of grass that might have caused it haha

ManUK (Manchester United) 6 years ago
In fact the commentator even said that! I remember lols
Ant (Liverpool) 6 years ago
Only in a hollywood movie.

I think the reason this topic created such reactions was because
1. Its called "Unsporting Fernando Torres" not "Is damaging the pitch unsporting? " or similar
2. By the time I saw it, it was already a couple of Man United chuckleheads giggling about Torres diving, losing the match etc, totally off topic
3. Tony said I was taking a swipe at United again - look at the title of the topic once more
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
Its an unsporting action ant, no matter how you want to dress it up.
Its was torres action, hence the topic headline.
I'm insulted at the chuckleheads jibe, if I'm one of them. I never said nothing about liverpool I only said very witty to rigg's.... Tongue in cheek because he never answered the question, and went off the tangent like yourself.
The title topic is what it is, whats the problem with that?
A trashed thread methinks, and i'll be thinking long and hard as to ever start another one, as they are not stands worthy as i've heard it said.
My last word on the subject, so much for sensible debate
Ant (Liverpool) 6 years ago
I think a topic like this, with the touchy subject matter and United-vs-Liverpool rivalry is really only going to get a certain kind of attention, and unfortunately for sensible conversation and reasons sake, it descended into slagging. Many apologies for that, sorry the thread got canned and certainly apologies for any personal offence caused. I totally take it back and am disappointed in myself that it even went that direction
Tony (footytube staff) 6 years ago
Not a problem ant, I will leave the topic open for debate, as I'm sure incidents of this weird nature have happened somewhere around the world, and I would love to hear about them, but I WILL delete anymore anti liverpool, utd comments, I don't care who kicked who, or who took a dive, that was never the question. So far all we have is ants goalkeeper moving the posts to suit himself, that's a classic
SirStig (Arsenal) 6 years ago
Like Rooney was going to miss regardless of a penalty spot or not LOL. But it was funny and I didn't expect that from Torres. But he should have at least gotten a yellow for unsportmanslike conduct
[account-removed] 6 years ago
Oh maybe he should have planted a flower there.... When a disgusting penalty had just be given for imaginary fault. Can't wait for the day when the fa discovers the real truth behind those more than genrous decisions that manure has been getting for so long.... Remember juventus!

Kick4Life - changing lives through football