Forums / The Stands: Intelligent Footy Debate
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Form Or Class?
Matt (Footytube Staff) 4 years ago
Whilst watching the FA Cup replay between Spurs and Fulham last night seeing Bobby Zamora continue his recent impressive run of form I was thinking how unlikely he is to make it into the English World Cup squad. But why should this be so?

He like Darren Bent are scoring lots of goals for unfashionable teams and is just as unlikely to figure in Capello's plans for the summer. Being overlooked for players at bigger teams. This situation has always happened with the English national side the cases of Steve Bull and Matt Le Tissier players who's form should of seen them getting many more caps than they did

It seems these players are hampered by their history and current clubs status. I have always been an advocate of picking your best team today not your best team based on popularity and performances two years ago. On the flip side of that is the old adage 'Form is temporary, class is permanent'.

So where do you stand on this do you pick your best players or the players playing best?
Tony (footytube staff) 4 years ago
Of course they deserve a chance, its hard scoring goals for an unfashionable team as you described them matt.
Surely it would be easier scoring goals with good players around you, aka the top four.
Put the top four team strikers in the unfashionable teams, and see how many they score then? .
One other thing to take into consideration, these strikers from the lower teams are still playing in the same league as the big boys, so I would give BIG credit to the players you have mentioned matt.
At least worth a real good look at, but its always gonna' be tough for them to oust the so called main england strikers
Nickstirling (Manchester United) 4 years ago
I think scoring goals for smaller teams is a completely different prospect to scoring for big teams, particularly in the league.

Let's ignore Wayne and go to Berbatov. He is expected to score in every game. Yet every team that plays United knows that they have to give them no space whatsoever up front or they will be punished. So there is less space. It's not a case of who they play. There are very few teams that play United and don't focus on defending. Not saying they don't go forward, but they have to be sure at the back.

The flipside is low to mid table clubs, and we'll talk about Zamora. He has previously shown glimmers of class but in general been wrank average. This season he has been outstanding though. The difference in playing for a mid table club is that when you play the bottom clubs, they are poor at defending (or they wouldn't be at the bottom) but they don't often don't manage to raise their game as much for mid table opposition as they are not quite as afraid of being crucified. So woeful defending often ensues. When you are at Fulham and you play against the likes of Chelsea, Arsenal and United (we'll leave the Scousers and their shocking season out of this) the onus is on them to attack. Which inevitably leaves space at the back. If, like Fulham, your mid table club is now magnificently well organised then there is a good chance of soaking up pressure and having chances at the other end.

So what this leaves us with is looking at play specifically. How many goals did they score, against whom. How much pressure was on them. How much time did they have. Was this capitalising on a mistake, or did they create their own time and space with good positioning, touch or strength. Finally how clinical are they and do they show a range of techniques when finishing.

Zamora has shown me more this season then Heskey ever has. That said, Heskey (or a player like him) is vital to Capello's tactics. He requires being double teamed and wins headers and knock downs for Wayne, Lampard and Gerrard. Zamora does this same role and has done so against the best, playing a vital role in the demolition of United not too long ago.... Now he is a serious threat in Europe and tore Juventus apart. His goal in the second leg against Wolfsburg (not too shabby an opposition either!) was class. His turn and strike perfection.

Defending at international level, as expected, is typically much more organised and accurate. There is less space, time and opportunities are rarely gifted. I have seen Darren Bent try to do it at the top level on a couple occasions and he looked like he was waiting for someone to put something on a plate for him. His touch was not good enough for the time he was given.

I would be pleasantly surprised if Capello took Zamora along as what I've seen from Europe this season, he can play a bit...
Yogan (Chelsea) 4 years ago
Yes, this is a really good topic. But that quote at the end of the third paragraph is merely true. May is the month when Capello picks his squad to go on the plane, but the World Cup is in June, and during that small period of time the player(s) the gaffer chooses could lose form. It is possible. But Zamora isn't one of that to lose form. He has been in great goalscoring mood all season. Darren Bent is one of the top 5 scorers. Heskey isn't. If I was the boss and had to pick five, II would pikc the best scoreres. Not Heskey!
Tony (footytube staff) 4 years ago
I would'nt have heskey in a pub team, he doesent offer a lot to be honest
CHELSEA61 (Chelsea) 4 years ago
Yeah I completely agree Tony. I don't have the slightest idea what Capello sees in Heskey? He's big which is probably his only asset. He's slow and has terrible accuracy and doesn't compliment anyone else in the squad
Ant (Liverpool) 4 years ago
I have to agree with the above. Heskey started as a great talent but by now, he's just a lumbering sidekick to whoever the main striker is - Rooney probably. I think Heskey keeps getting picked because he is good at holding up the ball?

Imagine Zamora up there, scoring for fun on the biggest stage in the footballing world. I have no doubt he would rise to the challenge
Tony (footytube staff) 4 years ago
He reminds me of frank bruno the boxer, NO, not the back end of a pantomine horse.... Lol, he just always looked to muscle bound and rigid
Eric (Manchester United) 4 years ago
For the World Cup, if the question is to take Bent/Zamora as opposed to Heskey then I believe the answer is easy: bring Bent or Zamora. Heskey is well past his prime and in the case of class vs form, no matter how much class has stuck with Heskey he just doesn't have the legs to keep up with the other English strikers. While it's clearly an extremely tough choice to pick a World Cup squad, I feel that you need to pick strikers who have had consistent form all year long. Rooney is straight class and has been a monster in front of net all season. The same can be said for Defoe and Crouch for most of the season. Bent has also been in great goalscoring form all season long. It's when we get to Zamora that things get a little tricky. I've always been a fan of his, but his form is not consistent enough. It's true he's in fantastic form now, but it's tough to say how he will perform on the World stage. I'd love to see him get a starting cap next to Rooney one of these games and see how things go. Class vs form? Form is important, but class brings out the best of an in or even out of form player. Class can produce when there is seemingly no hope on a striker's worst day. Just one little flicker of that underlying class will result in glory. But that's just my opinion
Ant (Liverpool) 4 years ago
To make a 'player ratings' analogy out of scores of ten, over the course of a few games, a class players would get ratings of 7, 7, 8, 7, 8. A form player might get 5, 5, 6, 9, 10

The question is, as a manager, would you prefer a guaranteed good performance (class player), or the risk of either a great or average performance (form player)?

I think that because so much rests on the managers shoulders, not least of all his own head (and job), they will usually go with the class players to avoid shock defeats that could be career-limiting moves
SergioRamos (Liverpool) 4 years ago
I know your all gonna' hate me for this.

But I say zamora is the second best striker we got, I think fabio's a idiot and not giving the in-form striker a game againts egypt. It couldn't went the wrong way, but now we have no justified answer. Is he gonna' do well in the england shirt.... We don't know.

If I was capello I would give him the go and take him to south africa. I really do believe he is better then bent and carton cole. And with the recent injuries, this might happen.

Zamora has been on form recentley and with the win againts juve might just make up fabio's mind, I just hope he does go in...
ManUK (Manchester United) 4 years ago
I think Zamora should make it. I watched the Juve game, this is more than form this is class. And like many have mentioned with injuries he really deserves a go. Who says he's just in good form at the moment? I've seen players turned permanently into class players because of form.

I also think that players like Zamora should probably move to bigger clubs in the future. Not to insult smaller clubs, but that needs to happen for a lot of people to get the credit they deserve
Czheff (Tottenham Hotspur) 4 years ago
Rooney, Crouch, Defoe, Zamora, Bent, Cole all seem deserving of a spot to me, gonna' be tough for Capello.... Then again, I'm American, so bring on Heskey!



   
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